vaccine pros/cons

[noelnole]

can someone link a good book/video on the pros and cons of the regular childhood vaccination schedule

not the covid bullshit but the measles mumps rubella etc pros and cons

i read "a shot in the dark" in the 90's, i was also told to read rfkjr's book the real anthony fauci

got some young people that need to make a decision regarding the vax and their child very soon and id like to help with their decision making

 

[TheMason]

---

Look up a podcast called "A Vaccine Conversation with Melissa and Doctor Bob." They have several episodes and breakdown each vaccine and the entire vaccine schedule.
Episodes 3 and 9 give you a general overview of the vaccines. I listened on Spotify.

 

[Old Glory]

In for this thread. I've been wondering about this for a while. I've looked before and it's hard to find research that opposes vaccinating them. I think I read somewhere that Japan has no childhood vaccines before age 2 and has the lowest rate of SIDS in the world but I would need to verify that.

We have a 4 and 1 year old, the 4 year old has gotten all of them outside the flu, but the 1 year old is "behind" and we're considering not vaccinating anymore moving forward. I'd love to learn more.

 

[ChicagoFats]

I think most vaccines (outside of Covid) have been well researched and tested and are overwhelmingly safe. Yes there are outliers and injuries can probably happen but those are statistically rare events and your child is more likely to be hurt by the disease itself. Basically the advantages of the vaccine outweigh the risks of the shots by a long shot.

I don’t believe the vaccines are related to autism crowd, I’ve read papers disproving those connections.

Mostly im skeptical of the Covid vaccine because it was rushed under hyper political conditions and the risks of Covid to children is minuscule. Therefore the risks of the shots do not outweigh its benefits for a large majority of the population. Other, well researched and tested vaccines do not have the same profile and I believe to be safe and effective.

 

[ch13ba]

I think most vaccines (outside of Covid) have been well researched and tested and are overwhelmingly safe. Yes there are outliers and injuries can probably happen but those are statistically rare events and your child is more likely to be hurt by the disease itself. Basically the advantages of the vaccine outweigh the risks of the shots by a long shot.

I don’t believe the vaccines are related to autism crowd, I’ve read papers disproving those connections.

Mostly im skeptical of the Covid vaccine because it was rushed under hyper political conditions and the risks of Covid to children is minuscule. Therefore the risks of the shots do not outweigh its benefits for a large majority of the population. Other, well researched and tested vaccines do not have the same profile and I believe to be safe and effective.

I know of a kid from my hometown that was meeting all benchmarks as a child. His parents have videos of him talking and socializing just like any other kid. He went to the Dr one day to get either a vaccine or a booster, had a seizure that day and was never the same afterword. He was nonverbal, low functioning autistic for the rest of his life.

I know this is anecdotal but it still happened as a direct result of one of the vaccines. And I’m not claiming that vaccines are responsible for all kids with various forms of autism, but man, there sure seem to be a lot more of these kids than there used to be. I’m sure some of that is due to autism just not really being a thing 30 years ago unless a kid was severe but my wife is a teacher, and some years she’ll have 30% of her class diagnosed as autistic when the walk in the door.

 

[yankmenoodle]

Compare illnesses of the regular population against the Amish, that don't vaccinate their children. It's an eye opener.

 

[Jtrain80]

In for this thread. I've been wondering about this for a while. I've looked before and it's hard to find research that opposes vaccinating them. I think I read somewhere that Japan has no childhood vaccines before age 2 and has the lowest rate of SIDS in the world but I would need to verify that.

We have a 4 and 1 year old, the 4 year old has gotten all of them outside the flu, but the 1 year old is "behind" and we're considering not vaccinating anymore moving forward. I'd love to learn more.

Look at the graph of autism vs the increase in vaccines.

I wouldn't give my kids another vaccine if I had to do it again.

 

[ChicagoFats]

I know of a kid from my hometown that was meeting all benchmarks as a child. His parents have videos of him talking and socializing just like any other kid. He went to the Dr one day to get either a vaccine or a booster, had a seizure that day and was never the same afterword. He was nonverbal, low functioning autistic for the rest of his life.

I know this is anecdotal but it still happened as a direct result of one of the vaccines. And I’m not claiming that vaccines are responsible for all kids with various forms of autism, but man, there sure seem to be a lot more of these kids than there used to be. I’m sure some of that is due to autism just not really being a thing 30 years ago unless a kid was severe but my wife is a teacher, and some years she’ll have 30% of her class diagnosed as autistic when the walk in the door.

Im not saying it can't happen or is impossible just that its highly unlikely, based on data, that vaccines cause autism. There will always be outliers and there will always be coincidences and there will always be thing that can not be explained.

I do agree that Autism is becoming more prevalent and that we have no idea why.

By almost any measure, for most vaccines, the risk of getting the disease itself is higher than the risk posed from the vaccine itself. That is not the same as risk-free and I acknowledge that.

 

[ChicagoFats]

Compare illnesses of the regular population against the Amish, that don't vaccinate their children. It's an eye opener.

Sure, but what if those people were getting the diseases that they were not vaccinating against? That is, what if they were actually getting the measels, mumps or whatever? To be fair you would need to weigh those adverse outcomes against the benefit of not catching the disease at all.

Most likely they don't get the diseases because the rest of society is vaccinated and not spreading those diseases. In essence they are getting a free ride and if everyone adhered to their philosophy the data (or your observation of them not catching the diseases) would not look the same.

 

[ChicagoFats]

Look at the graph of autism vs the increase in vaccines.

I wouldn't give my kids another vaccine if I had to do it again.

Just because two things look similar on a graph does not mean they are related. We are an advanced enough society to dig a little deeper than that.

 

[22*43*51]

Vaccine Con - You're no longer human

Vaccine Pro - You and your new species have clots in common.

 

[yankmenoodle]

Sure, but what if those people were getting the diseases that they were not vaccinating against? That is, what if they were actually getting the measels, mumps or whatever? To be fair you would need to weigh those adverse outcomes against the benefit of not catching the disease at all.

Most likely they don't get the diseases because the rest of society is vaccinated and not spreading those diseases. In essence they are getting a free ride and if everyone adhered to their philosophy the data (or your observation of them not catching the diseases) would not look the same.

When I was a kid, we only had a smallpox vaccine. When someone in the family got measles or mumps, our parents took us to visit so we'd be infected now instead of when we were older, and more vulnerable.

 

[Jtrain80]

Just because two things look similar on a graph does not mean they are related. We are an advanced enough society to dig a little deeper than that.

Maybe. Do we have a control group not being filled full of pharms to look at?

I have a borderline autistic child so it hits close to home for me.

 

[AmericanViking]

In for this thread. I've been wondering about this for a while. I've looked before and it's hard to find research that opposes vaccinating them. I think I read somewhere that Japan has no childhood vaccines before age 2 and has the lowest rate of SIDS in the world but I would need to verify that.

We have a 4 and 1 year old, the 4 year old has gotten all of them outside the flu, but the 1 year old is "behind" and we're considering not vaccinating anymore moving forward. I'd love to learn more.

We have SADS now. Be interesting to see if Japan has the same.

 

[AmericanViking]

Sure, but what if those people were getting the diseases that they were not vaccinating against? That is, what if they were actually getting the measels, mumps or whatever? To be fair you would need to weigh those adverse outcomes against the benefit of not catching the disease at all.

Most likely they don't get the diseases because the rest of society is vaccinated and not spreading those diseases. In essence they are getting a free ride and if everyone adhered to their philosophy the data (or your observation of them not catching the diseases) would not look the same.

This is a big part of why the covid jab hysteria was so damned stupid. A vaccinated population also protects those that choose not to do so significantly. It’s why I’ve never really worried about true anti-vaxxers. Their decision.

I will also admit I worried every time we took our kids in because of the autism stuff. Our pediatrician actually did a much less aggressive regimen. Any idea what the prevalence of cancer is in the Amish vs the gen pop?

 

[Old Glory]

Amish People Stay Healthy in Old Age. Here's Their Secret

It all starts with their lifestyle

time.com

THE AMISH OBESITY STUDIES

Discover how the Amish consume 4,000 calories a day and maintain their weight.

www.worldlifeexpectancy.com

Some interesting pieces on the Amish. They don't talk about the vaccines in them but they do talk about how they live almost as long as the average American's lifespan without all of the modern conveniences and medicine that we have access to.

From Time: "The average American life expectancy is currently just under 79 years. Back in 1900, it was only 47, but for early–20th century Amish it was already greater than 70. Over the decades, most Americans have caught up in overall life expectancy, but the Amish still have a significant edge in late-life health, with lower rates of cancer, cardiovascular disease, diabetes and more. So how do they do it?"

 

[ChicagoFats]

Amish People Stay Healthy in Old Age. Here's Their Secret

It all starts with their lifestyle

time.com

THE AMISH OBESITY STUDIES

Discover how the Amish consume 4,000 calories a day and maintain their weight.

www.worldlifeexpectancy.com

Some interesting pieces on the Amish. They don't talk about the vaccines in them but they do talk about how they live almost as long as the average American's lifespan without all of the modern conveniences and medicine that we have access to.

From Time: "The average American life expectancy is currently just under 79 years. Back in 1900, it was only 47, but for early–20th century Amish it was already greater than 70. Over the decades, most Americans have caught up in overall life expectancy, but the Amish still have a significant edge in late-life health, with lower rates of cancer, cardiovascular disease, diabetes and more. So how do they do it?"

I believe the Greeks have the longest lifespan of all? Will need to confirm that.

A lot of theories about diet, vaccines etc but no proof.

Overall I personally believe that the advance in modern medicine is correlated to extended lifespan. Can't prove it though.

Also, modern medicine is one of those things you sometimes don't appreciate until you need it. When you are in pain, you will take any solution available.

 

[ChicagoFats]

Maybe. Do we have a control group not being filled full of pharms to look at?

I have a borderline autistic child so it hits close to home for me.

I am guardian for an autistic / borderline retarded adult so I am pretty in touch also. Not saying that makes my opinions any more valid, but i experience it almost everyday. I also have a son with physical disabilities, his legs are messed up, didnt walk until age 4 and still uses crutches to walk at age 8.

Sorry to hear about your child and i know that its tough on his family. I hope for the best for you and your family.

I still dont think vaccines have anything to do with it. Again, my opinion is no more valid than the rest, its just my belief. Sometimes weird shit happens and I have come to accept that.

 

[Old Glory]

I believe the Greeks have the longest lifespan of all? Will need to confirm that.

A lot of theories about diet, vaccines etc but no proof.

Overall I personally believe that the advance in modern medicine is correlated to extended lifespan. Can't prove it though.

Also, modern medicine is one of those things you sometimes don't appreciate until you need it. When you are in pain, you will take any solution available.

I'd be curious to dive more into it too. Someone mentioned the Amish not getting any vaccines and not having any disease prevalence so I was curious about their lifespan.

I agree with the advancement of modern medicine being a huge plus for society. You have to consider everything though, diet, environment, lifestyle, etc. The Greeks are active, have a great work life balance, eat a well balanced diet, and have a great social life that all contribute to their lifespan. Probably other things that I am missing.

That being said, there are many instances of government led programs that give me concern.

I.e. https://www.forbes.com/sites/leahro...f-testing-vaccines-on-humans/?sh=3afa7052279c

More polio cases now caused by vaccine than by wild virus

More polio cases now caused by vaccine than by wild virus as 4 African countries report them

abcnews.go.com

I can't find it quickly but the famous picture of all the children in iron lungs with Polio that was caused by the vaccine.

I don't think they've been nefarious up until the Covid vax but it certainly caused me to pause and think.

 

[Jayhacker]

There's absolutely nothing in the jab that has anything to do with a vaccine.

 

[N. Pappagiorgio]

 

[Jtrain80]

I am guardian for an autistic / borderline retarded adult so I am pretty in touch also. Not saying that makes my opinions any more valid, but i experience it almost everyday. I also have a son with physical disabilities, his legs are messed up, didnt walk until age 4 and still uses crutches to walk at age 8.

Sorry to hear about your child and i know that its tough on his family. I hope for the best for you and your family.

I still dont think vaccines have anything to do with it. Again, my opinion is no more valid than the rest, its just my belief. Sometimes weird shit happens and I have come to accept that.

He is 9 and more in the knuckle head realm than autistic, but 2-6 was a rough time.

Wife and I try not to think about it like that, and my one thought is that everyone tries to throw a label at things where as 40 or 50 yrs we would have just said, " that boy ain't right..."

Back to my original point, what in society has changed to create an obvious increase in this category? I think about things like this.