The Truth

[QuanChi]

There will be no "collapse" the way some of these people think of it. It's not going to be like the movie "Dawn of the Dead" or whatever where one day suddenly shit hits the fan and prices skyrocket and everyone begins to riot and the SS comes marching down the street to kill everyone. There will be no "happening." It's far more insidious than that. Read the poem "The Hollow Men" by TS Eliot and you'll understand You'll just notice that every day simple things will become a little more expensive. Everyone's homes and apartments will start to get smaller. Your work hours will get longer, but your pay will decrease. You'll see family and friends less, and find that in time you care less about them. Every day you'll find yourself lowering your standards for everything: work, food, relationships, etc. Job security will no longer exist as a concept. You'll notice houses and apartments shrinking. People will start hanging on to clothing longer and longer. Less people will get married, even less will have children. People will engross themselves in technological distractions and fantasy
while never truly experiencing the real world. Whatever dream people used to have about what their lives were going to be will become for them a distant memory. The only thing left for them will be the reality of their debt and their poverty. And every minute of every
day they will be told, "You are stupid, ugly, and weak, but together we are free, prosperous, and safe." That is the collapse. The reduction of the American man into a feudal serf, incapable of feeling love or hate,
incapable of seeing the pitiful nature of his situation for what it is or recognizing his own self worth.

 

[LafesterMacintosh]

 

[absoluteUnit]

There will be no "collapse" the way some of these people think of it. It's not going to be like the movie "Dawn of the Dead" or whatever where one day suddenly shit hits the fan and prices skyrocket and everyone begins to riot and the SS comes marching down the street to kill everyone. There will be no "happening." It's far more insidious than that. Read the poem "The Hollow Men" by TS Eliot and you'll understand You'll just notice that every day simple things will become a little more expensive. Everyone's homes and apartments will start to get smaller. Your work hours will get longer, but your pay will decrease. You'll see family and friends less, and find that in time you care less about them. Every day you'll find yourself lowering your standards for everything: work, food, relationships, etc. Job security will no longer exist as a concept. You'll notice houses and apartments shrinking. People will start hanging on to clothing longer and longer. Less people will get married, even less will have children. People will engross themselves in technological distractions and fantasy
while never truly experiencing the real world. Whatever dream people used to have about what their lives were going to be will become for them a distant memory. The only thing left for them will be the reality of their debt and their poverty. And every minute of every
day they will be told, "You are stupid, ugly, and weak, but together we are free, prosperous, and safe." That is the collapse. The reduction of the American man into a feudal serf, incapable of feeling love or hate,
incapable of seeing the pitiful nature of his situation for what it is or recognizing his own self worth.

That quite literally was the worst poem I’ve ever read (and I’ve read a lot). Thanks for wasting 10 minutes of my life

 

[STMF2X]

 

[racernhra]

That quite literally was the worst poem I’ve ever read (and I’ve read a lot). Thanks for wasting 10 minutes of my life

Wait. It took you 10 minutes to read that?

 

[LafesterMacintosh]

Wait. It took you 10 minutes to read that?

Wait, you actually read it?

 

[fschmidt]

Things will get worse and worse as people get shittier and shittier. That is the only certainty. But how fast, no one knows.

 

[CuriousFiend]

Things will get worse and worse as people get shittier and shittier. That is the only certainty. But how fast, no one knows.

Man I must be tripppin.....

....are you certain?

...seems like,......kinda paradoxical or someshit to say: something-"is the only certainty"-innit?

Coz it implies there is a > thing < that is said to be a certainty — which would of course imply a > certainty < of a > certainty < and therefore at least two certainties....and a third...oh, fuck,... I may have just created a feedback loop,...

 

[weaponoffreedom]

There will be no "collapse" the way some of these people think of it. It's not going to be like the movie "Dawn of the Dead" or whatever where one day suddenly shit hits the fan and prices skyrocket and everyone begins to riot and the SS comes marching down the street to kill everyone. There will be no "happening." It's far more insidious than that. Read the poem "The Hollow Men" by TS Eliot and you'll understand You'll just notice that every day simple things will become a little more expensive. Everyone's homes and apartments will start to get smaller. Your work hours will get longer, but your pay will decrease. You'll see family and friends less, and find that in time you care less about them. Every day you'll find yourself lowering your standards for everything: work, food, relationships, etc. Job security will no longer exist as a concept. You'll notice houses and apartments shrinking. People will start hanging on to clothing longer and longer. Less people will get married, even less will have children. People will engross themselves in technological distractions and fantasy
while never truly experiencing the real world. Whatever dream people used to have about what their lives were going to be will become for them a distant memory. The only thing left for them will be the reality of their debt and their poverty. And every minute of every
day they will be told, "You are stupid, ugly, and weak, but together we are free, prosperous, and safe." That is the collapse. The reduction of the American man into a feudal serf, incapable of feeling love or hate,
incapable of seeing the pitiful nature of his situation for what it is or recognizing his own self worth.

I think the '"powers that be" figured out long ago that the "by force" method would not work, or at least work in the long game. Collapse, no. Decay, yes.

Good post.

 

[CuriousFiend]

There will be no "collapse" the way some of these people think of it. It's not going to be like the movie "Dawn of the Dead" or whatever where one day suddenly shit hits the fan and prices skyrocket and everyone begins to riot and the SS comes marching down the street to kill everyone. There will be no "happening." It's far more insidious than that. Read the poem "The Hollow Men" by TS Eliot and you'll understand You'll just notice that every day simple things will become a little more expensive. Everyone's homes and apartments will start to get smaller. Your work hours will get longer, but your pay will decrease. You'll see family and friends less, and find that in time you care less about them. Every day you'll find yourself lowering your standards for everything: work, food, relationships, etc. Job security will no longer exist as a concept. You'll notice houses and apartments shrinking. People will start hanging on to clothing longer and longer. Less people will get married, even less will have children. People will engross themselves in technological distractions and fantasy
while never truly experiencing the real world. Whatever dream people used to have about what their lives were going to be will become for them a distant memory. The only thing left for them will be the reality of their debt and their poverty. And every minute of every
day they will be told, "You are stupid, ugly, and weak, but together we are free, prosperous, and safe." That is the collapse. The reduction of the American man into a feudal serf, incapable of feeling love or hate,
incapable of seeing the pitiful nature of his situation for what it is or recognizing his own self worth.

Could be right aye.

Hang on, that's basically already the current shituation ain't it?

Well, I can't speak for America but it's pretty fuckin' close to that here, in little Australia.

Happening so slowly but steadily that cunts acclimate to the ever shittier existence imposed upon the population.

If someone from 1991 suddenly appeared now, they'd definitely notice the absolutely fucked state of shit by comparison.

I would not be surprised if this is what happens prior to a mass extinction event.

There's a fair bit of evidence seeming to suggest previous relatively advanced civilizations have existed—yet suddenly ceased as if a worldwide event wiped everyone out.

Who was Noah....really?

Bet the "jews" hijacked that story.

Noah & famz + animals were probably like the ancient Mark Cuckerborgs, or some other swinish ancient ultra wealthy fagglets hiding out in their doomsday bunkers. They probably did some shit like setting off hundreds of subterranean nukes strategically bored below the oceans floors around the world, while the parasitic "elites" slinked off to their hovels—everyone else would be swept away. Dunno if ya'z have been noticing there's been talk about some kinda major "Event²⁰²⁴"

What are the ultra wealthy building bunkers for?

Even dribble guts Biden has one.

 

[MalO]

I think there will be a huge economic collapse but I don't know when. It shocks me that they've managed to keep things from blowing up for so long.

All I know is this isn't sustainable. The country is over 30 trillion dollars in debt, has a trade deficit, a student loan bubble, an auto industry bubble, a huge housing bubble, and wages have been stagnant for over a decade. More than 40 million on food stamps and the number is increasing, and our border is wide open allowing illegals to enter the country and work for less than minimum - at a time we are developing AI and advanced robotics and robots could replace illegal immigrant laborers entirely. So what happens then?

Wealth disparity is worse now than it was during the Gilded Age. Cost of living is crushing the majority of American families meanwhile corporate executives give themselves more bonuses and raises and outsource jobs and pay any American workers they have peanuts for wages. Banks don't care about all the debt as long as they can fart around with infinite money and the federal reserve just keeps printing more.

Problem after problem after problem

and every government official just wants to line their own pockets and only care about corporate lobbyists and rich mega-donors. They couldn't care less about the plight of the people.

It's all going to blow up eventually.

I was thinking yesterday about how dictators rise to power. We're told in school that Hitler rose to power on a wave of popular support, and I don't think that's true. There are plenty of people who hated him, or tolerated him, or couldn't care less who their leader is. I think the single most critical factor that causes a dictator to rise to power is a corrupt, dysfunctional government. When the existing government is no longer able to meets the needs of the people and keep a healthy economy running, then the people will accept a dictator as long as they can restore the economy to a state of health. Basically they aren't the leader that the people want, they are the leader that the people need.

Hitler rose to power because of crushing war reparations and the treaty of Versailles. Not because the German people wanted to conquer the world and kill everyone. That is what HItler wanted to do, but the German people just wanted a healthy economy.

The same scenario is playing out in the USA right now. It could very well be that our economic collapse leads to a dictatorship.

Just remember it's not populism that creates dictators. It's cronyism and corruption. The dictator is just nature's answer to the problem.

 

[Rva]

as long as they’re still shirtless, black athletes being photographed, we will be all right

 

[Rebarcock.]

Well it'll all happen when Chyna and USA have a debt implosion. Which for all practical purposes will be soon. Chyna has trillions of off book debt that rivals our 35 trillion that we know about. I'm certain there is a ton more in off books debt too

 

[Rebarcock.]

There will be no "collapse" the way some of these people think of it. It's not going to be like the movie "Dawn of the Dead" or whatever where one day suddenly shit hits the fan and prices skyrocket and everyone begins to riot and the SS comes marching down the street to kill everyone. There will be no "happening." It's far more insidious than that. Read the poem "The Hollow Men" by TS Eliot and you'll understand You'll just notice that every day simple things will become a little more expensive. Everyone's homes and apartments will start to get smaller. Your work hours will get longer, but your pay will decrease. You'll see family and friends less, and find that in time you care less about them. Every day you'll find yourself lowering your standards for everything: work, food, relationships, etc. Job security will no longer exist as a concept. You'll notice houses and apartments shrinking. People will start hanging on to clothing longer and longer. Less people will get married, even less will have children. People will engross themselves in technological distractions and fantasy
while never truly experiencing the real world. Whatever dream people used to have about what their lives were going to be will become for them a distant memory. The only thing left for them will be the reality of their debt and their poverty. And every minute of every
day they will be told, "You are stupid, ugly, and weak, but together we are free, prosperous, and safe." That is the collapse. The reduction of the American man into a feudal serf, incapable of feeling love or hate,
incapable of seeing the pitiful nature of his situation for what it is or recognizing his own self worth.

You are stupid ugly and weak. You fucking weirdo. Don't ever send me your weirdo shit again pervert

 

[Joe King]

our 35 trillion that we know about.

Something most don't think about when considering that debt, is that it doesn't include the interest that must also be paid.

I'm certain there is a ton more in off books debt too

There is at least $100 trillion in unfunded liabilities over the next 75 years.

Does that count as off books debt?

 

[Rebarcock.]

Something most don't think about when considering that debt, is that it doesn't include the interest that must also be paid.


There is at least $100 trillion in unfunded liabilities over the next 75 years.

Does that count as off books debt?

Yes that is precisely what I was referring to

 

[TheResister]

There will be no "collapse" the way some of these people think of it. It's not going to be like the movie "Dawn of the Dead" or whatever where one day suddenly shit hits the fan and prices skyrocket and everyone begins to riot and the SS comes marching down the street to kill everyone. There will be no "happening." It's far more insidious than that. Read the poem "The Hollow Men" by TS Eliot and you'll understand You'll just notice that every day simple things will become a little more expensive. Everyone's homes and apartments will start to get smaller. Your work hours will get longer, but your pay will decrease. You'll see family and friends less, and find that in time you care less about them. Every day you'll find yourself lowering your standards for everything: work, food, relationships, etc. Job security will no longer exist as a concept. You'll notice houses and apartments shrinking. People will start hanging on to clothing longer and longer. Less people will get married, even less will have children. People will engross themselves in technological distractions and fantasy
while never truly experiencing the real world. Whatever dream people used to have about what their lives were going to be will become for them a distant memory. The only thing left for them will be the reality of their debt and their poverty. And every minute of every
day they will be told, "You are stupid, ugly, and weak, but together we are free, prosperous, and safe." That is the collapse. The reduction of the American man into a feudal serf, incapable of feeling love or hate,
incapable of seeing the pitiful nature of his situation for what it is or recognizing his own self worth.

What you're talking about is already happening. Let's put this in perspective:

My grandmother had nine kids. My grandparents owned their own home, albeit it a very crude example by today's standards. But, my grandmother owned it and most of her children turned out to be business owners, teachers or otherwise gainfully employed. My mother had four children. There are only three kids between all of my siblings and I. We are representative examples of the American people. We have smaller families, live on less acreage, have smaller houses AND the current generation is less affluent than their parents. We are entering the second generation since the founding of this country where that is happening.

The balance of what you say happens on this board on a daily basis. An honest question becomes an allegation of trolling; some people live to call their fellow man stupid, a retard, etc. Those people aren't intelligent enough to have a real conversation about the world situation. They damn sure aren't going to be part of any solution. While you're talking about so - called "illegal immigrants" I overheard an economist being interviewed a couple of weeks ago. He said that at least 7 million American males between the ages of 17 and 54 are not in the labor market and have no intention of ever going out to look for a job. Imagine that many males with a median age of being a middle age man with no job, no education, no skill sets, no work history, no record upon which to draw any conclusions should you entertain the idea of hiring them. Many of them have a criminal history, a drug habit and look like refugees from a bad circus with their multiple tattoos and body piercings. NEW WORLD ORDER here we come!

 

[Densel]

There will be no "collapse" the way some of these people think of it. It's not going to be like the movie "Dawn of the Dead" or whatever where one day suddenly shit hits the fan and prices skyrocket and everyone begins to riot and the SS comes marching down the street to kill everyone. There will be no "happening." It's far more insidious than that. Read the poem "The Hollow Men" by TS Eliot and you'll understand You'll just notice that every day simple things will become a little more expensive. Everyone's homes and apartments will start to get smaller. Your work hours will get longer, but your pay will decrease. You'll see family and friends less, and find that in time you care less about them. Every day you'll find yourself lowering your standards for everything: work, food, relationships, etc. Job security will no longer exist as a concept. You'll notice houses and apartments shrinking. People will start hanging on to clothing longer and longer. Less people will get married, even less will have children. People will engross themselves in technological distractions and fantasy
while never truly experiencing the real world. Whatever dream people used to have about what their lives were going to be will become for them a distant memory. The only thing left for them will be the reality of their debt and their poverty. And every minute of every
day they will be told, "You are stupid, ugly, and weak, but together we are free, prosperous, and safe." That is the collapse. The reduction of the American man into a feudal serf, incapable of feeling love or hate,
incapable of seeing the pitiful nature of his situation for what it is or recognizing his own self worth.

Wow! This really resonated with me. I have been noticing some of this since I was a kid.

 

[MalO]

What you're talking about is already happening. Let's put this in perspective:

My grandmother had nine kids. My grandparents owned their own home, albeit it a very crude example by today's standards. But, my grandmother owned it and most of her children turned out to be business owners, teachers or otherwise gainfully employed. My mother had four children. There are only three kids between all of my siblings and I. We are representative examples of the American people. We have smaller families, live on less acreage, have smaller houses AND the current generation is less affluent than their parents. We are entering the second generation since the founding of this country where that is happening.

The balance of what you say happens on this board on a daily basis. An honest question becomes an allegation of trolling; some people live to call their fellow man stupid, a retard, etc. Those people aren't intelligent enough to have a real conversation about the world situation. They damn sure aren't going to be part of any solution. While you're talking about so - called "illegal immigrants" I overheard an economist being interviewed a couple of weeks ago. He said that at least 7 million American males between the ages of 17 and 54 are not in the labor market and have no intention of ever going out to look for a job. Imagine that many males with a median age of being a middle age man with no job, no education, no skill sets, no work history, no record upon which to draw any conclusions should you entertain the idea of hiring them. Many of them have a criminal history, a drug habit and look like refugees from a bad circus with their multiple tattoos and body piercings. NEW WORLD ORDER here we come!

Are you familiar with the welfare cliff? Millions of people don't want to work because they would earn less working a minimum wage job than they can collect being on welfare.

The ‘Welfare Cliff’: How The Benefit Scale Discourages Work | U.S. Senate Committee On The Budget

The Official U.S. Senate Committee On The Budget

www.budget.senate.gov

A paper presented at the American Enterprise Institute by the Pennsylvania Secretary of Public Welfare found that because of the stacking of welfare benefits, many individuals receiving welfare stand to lose financially by increasing their income. In one example, the study demonstrated how a single parent with two children earning $29,000 would have a net income, including welfare benefits, of $57,000. Therefore, the individual would need annual earnings to jump from $29,000 to $69,000 (pre-tax) to maintain the same standard of living without welfare benefits.

Welfare is adjusted for cost of living increases, but the minimum wage is not. The last time the minimum wage increased was in 2009. It's been stagnant for 15 years and there is a lot of inflation which has happened since especially the last few years.

Where as you're saying "we need these illegal immigrants because our citizens won't work" you're only seeing the viewpoint of the big business owners who have thier heads in the clouds and can't see the true scope and scale of the problem.

The minimum wage needs to increase - substantially. There is no doubt in my mind that the vast majority of those unemployed hopeless people would be happy to work a job if they could earn more than what their welfare benefits provide them.

But that would mean like a $30 minimum wage, which sounds correct to me given all the inflation and cost of living increases - for years now that's what I think is about where it would need to be to provide an actual middle class standard of living to most people. That's where it would need to be for Millenials to live the same life that their boomer parents had.

But the rich would throw a temper tantrum. They would thrash and scream like babies. There's no way they would accept that. This is why they keep the border open and let in tens of millions of illegals. Why pay your fellow citizen a fair wage when you can exploit slave labor?

That's basically what illegal immigrants are. Or what outsourcing to China is. The year is 2024 and big business still is only able to operate by exploiting slaves.

 

[MalO]

If I had kids I could earn more by being on welfare than I do by working my current job.

 

[TheResister]

Are you familiar with the welfare cliff? Millions of people don't want to work because they would earn less working a minimum wage job than they can collect being on welfare.

The ‘Welfare Cliff’: How The Benefit Scale Discourages Work | U.S. Senate Committee On The Budget

The Official U.S. Senate Committee On The Budget

www.budget.senate.gov

Welfare is adjusted for cost of living increases, but the minimum wage is not. The last time the minimum wage increased was in 2009. It's been stagnant for 15 years and there is a lot of inflation which has happened since especially the last few years.

Where as you're saying "we need these illegal immigrants because our citizens won't work" you're only seeing the viewpoint of the big business owners who have thier heads in the clouds and can't see the true scope and scale of the problem.

The minimum wage needs to increase - substantially. There is no doubt in my mind that the vast majority of those unemployed hopeless people would be happy to work a job if they could earn more than what their welfare benefits provide them.

But that would mean like a $30 minimum wage, which sounds correct to me given all the inflation and cost of living increases - for years now that's what I think is about where it would need to be to provide an actual middle class standard of living to most people. That's where it would need to be for Millenials to live the same life that their boomer parents had.

But the rich would throw a temper tantrum. They would thrash and scream like babies. There's no way they would accept that. This is why they keep the border open and let in tens of millions of illegals. Why pay your fellow citizen a fair wage when you can exploit slave labor?

That's basically what illegal immigrants are. Or what outsourcing to China is. The year is 2024 and big business still is only able to operate by exploiting slaves.

Here is the rub:

Every time the minimum wage is adjusted, business raises the cost of doing business so that the percentages remain constant. If they double your wages, the prices for goods and services doubles.

The typical knee jerk reaction is to jump into socialism. It promises to balance that out. Socialism is a failure. Let's go a step further. When businesses don't pay, it is the taxpayers that pick up the slack. Once, several years ago, I researched and found out that the largest group of people whose children were drawing what is known as Peach Care in Georgia (state Medicaid for children) were the children of Walmart employees. So, Walmart wasn't paying their employees enough money; the taxpayers are required to pay via taxes so that the children of Walmart employees can afford health care. How do we get employers to pay up?

At the county level, the county should not grant a business license to a company that cannot afford to pay their employees a livable wage. And what is a livable wage? Figure the cost of housing. An employee should be able to afford minimal housing on 25 percent of their salary. So, if an area has rental apartments that can be had for $700 a month as a starting price, then the minimum wage it takes to live in that county is $2,800 a month. That works out to just under $17 an hour.

That means that county planners should be able to determine how many rental units it would take to guarantee that every business has the potential to hire workers that can afford to live there and that way no building permits are issued for more expensive rental units until enough rental units are built to accommodate lower cost housing. Now, let's solve the issue at the federal level AND give you relief from so - called "illegal immigrants / aliens."

Taxes on businesses should be as high as humanly possible. We might even consider taxes to be 40 percent on a business. Then we allow for very generous tax breaks in the following areas:

Pay American employees 20 percent over poverty level wages to start - tax break
Hire an all American staff - tax break
Provide jobs for handicapped, elderly part time, and /or take someone off the welfare dole - tax break
Provide child care for employees - tax break
Bring jobs back to the U.S. - tax break

Finally, in order to make this system work at its optimum, the states should require every welfare recipient (along with those who claim any kind of unemployment, food assistance, etc.) to register with the state employment agencies. If after three months they cannot find work, they start going to classes and counseling with state employment specialists. The objective is to get those people back into the labor market. After six months of unemployment, they could do community service for their taxpayer paid benefits.

Should you ever want to discuss this in a REAL think tank atmosphere: resisters.freeforums.net

 

[MalO]

"but they will just increase prices" is just an excuse. So is trying to dump all the responsibility on local government.

The fact is minimum wage has been stagnant for 15 years and they've been jacking up prices sky-high anyway. It has nothing to do with labor cost and everything to do with corruption and greed. Wealth inequality is worse today than ever before in the history of the USA. Executives are raking in record profits and paying their workers less and less.





You're right socialism isn't the answer. So let's get rid of socialism for the rich.

The USA needs capitalism for everyone, not just the poor.

 

[Liquid Reigns]

Welfare Use by Immigrants and the U.S.-Born

This analysis shows both immigrants and the U.S.-born make extensive use of means-tested anti-poverty programs, with immigrant households significantly more likely to receive benefits.

cis.org

This report is based on newly released data from the 2022 Survey of Income and Program Participation (SIPP). Analysis of this data shows both immigrants and the U.S.-born make extensive use of means-tested anti-poverty programs, with immigrant households significantly more likely to receive benefits. This is primarily because the American welfare system is designed in large part to help low-income families with children, which describes a large share of immigrants. The ability of immigrants, including illegal immigrants, to receive welfare benefits on behalf of U.S.-born citizen children is a key reason why restrictions on welfare use for new legal immigrants, and illegal immigrants, are relatively ineffective.

 

[Joe King]

Are you familiar with the welfare cliff? Millions of people don't want to work because they would earn less working a minimum wage job than they can collect being on welfare.

Anyone working a minimum wage job for more than a year or two out of high school, has no one to blame but themselves. Minimum wage is for entry level workers with no skills.

Once they have some work experience and have proven themselves capable of doing a good job and showing up for work on time every day, they can then start looking for a better job that pays more. Then wash rinse, repeat until they attain the wages they desire.

Where as you're saying "we need these illegal immigrants because our citizens won't work" you're only seeing the viewpoint of the big business owners who have thier heads in the clouds and can't see the true scope and scale of the problem.

As for illegal immigrants (now called "asylum seekers lol) We do not need them.

The minimum wage needs to increase - substantially.

If anything, it needs to go away.

There is no doubt in my mind that the vast majority of those unemployed hopeless people would be happy to work a job if they could earn more than what their welfare benefits provide them.

The problem is, most of these types want it right away and no not want to put in the time at the lower wage to improve their skills so that they can get a better job. They want it all handed to them now, without having to prove that they deserve a higher wage.

Every time the minimum wage is adjusted, business raises the cost of doing business so that the percentages remain constant. If they double your wages, the prices for goods and services doubles.

It stands to reason that for any business to be successful, all costs must be passed along in the final cost of their product or service.

Be it wages, taxes, or even just the electric bill, the cost must be covered in the prices charged to their customers.

The typical knee jerk reaction is to jump into socialism.

Only by the terminally ignorant.

Socialism is a failure.

Absolutely!

How do we get employers to pay up?

By having a smaller workforce. That way they'll have to pay more in order to attract and retain employees.

As long as we have a huge supply of cheap labor, wages will stay low.

If you had a job that needed doing, and you had 100 people competing for that one job, would you want to pay top dollar if there were others willing to do the job for less?

The fact is minimum wage has been stagnant for 15 years and they've been jacking up prices sky-high anyway.

Inflation is due to the monetary and fiscal mismanagement by the federal reserve, the gov and the banking system.

let's get rid of socialism for the rich.

The USA needs capitalism for everyone, not just the poor.

Absolutely!

 

[TheResister]

Anyone working a minimum wage job for more than a year or two out of high school, has no one to blame but themselves. Minimum wage is for entry level workers with no skills.

Once they have some work experience and have proven themselves capable of doing a good job and showing up for work on time every day, they can then start looking for a better job that pays more. Then wash rinse, repeat until they attain the wages they desire.



As for illegal immigrants (now called "asylum seekers lol) We do not need them.



If anything, it needs to go away.



The problem is, most of these types want it right away and no not want to put in the time at the lower wage to improve their skills so that they can get a better job. They want it all handed to them now, without having to prove that they deserve a higher wage.



It stands to reason that for any business to be successful, all costs must be passed along in the final cost of their product or service.

Be it wages, taxes, or even just the electric bill, the cost must be covered in the prices charged to their customers.



Only by the terminally ignorant.



Absolutely!



By having a smaller workforce. That way they'll have to pay more in order to attract and retain employees.

As long as we have a huge supply of cheap labor, wages will stay low.

If you had a job that needed doing, and you had 100 people competing for that one job, would you want to pay top dollar if there were others willing to do the job for less?



Inflation is due to the monetary and fiscal mismanagement by the federal reserve, the gov and the banking system.



Absolutely!

Your responses are short sighted. There will always be more people than jobs. Even when the jobless rate is astronomical, there are jobs to be had. Once we had a gas shortage. EVERYBODY was laying off. It was so bad that if your car tag ended in an even number you could buy gas on even numbered days; car tags ending in odd numbers could get gas on odd numbered days. You couldn't buy a $2 an hour job even with $5 an hour to pay for it.

I went to work as a locksmith and was working 12 hour days back then. The right is leaving the back door open for the continued existence of the income tax, Federal Reserve, IRS, etc. Unless and until you understand what the REAL problem is, it will continue to exist. The masses will demand socialism.

I'm proposing to take the laborer off the street and have them learn transferable skills. I'm proposing to allow employers to take advantage of the foreign laborers, but pay so much in taxes that we can afford to keep up the non-working Americans. If you have 100 people to pick from but, 80 of them will cost you in higher taxes versus better pay for the American worker, it's pretty simple which way you will go.

 

[weaponoffreedom]

"but they will just increase prices" is just an excuse

excuse for what, cause and effect cocksucker.......went out and bought much lately?

Wealth inequality is worse today than ever before in the history of the USA

Wrong as fuck. What kind of car do you have? Did you know that the vast majority of folks in the 1800s did not even have a horse or wagon for transpo? Most "owned nothing". Today the vast majority of people have the basics.........on welfare, with six kids, but they got that 1000$ smartphone nigga.

Executives are raking in record profits and paying their workers less and less.

try something new........I am a business owner, and reap the max benefits, why give them to some one else? Human altruism does not exist.

 

[Joe King]

Your responses are short sighted.

Not at all. People gaining experience and finding a better job is how it is supposed to work.

There will always be more people than jobs.

So? The answer to to have employers have to compete for workers.

Even when the jobless rate is astronomical, there are jobs to be had. Once we had a gas shortage. EVERYBODY was laying off. It was so bad that if your car tag ended in an even number you could buy gas on even numbered days; car tags ending in odd numbers could get gas on odd numbered days. You couldn't buy a $2 an hour job even with $5 an hour to pay for it.

Of course there are always some jobs available, but you seem to be contradicting yourself. Because if you can't even pay to get a job, that would prove your first statement wrong.

I went to work as a locksmith and was working 12 hour days back then. The right is leaving the back door open for the continued existence of the income tax, Federal Reserve, IRS, etc.

I agree, all that needs to go.
...but the truth is, virtually everyone has taken action that causes themselves to become liable for those taxes. If you volunteer to pay, then pay you must. Had the masses not fallen all over themselves to volunteer for it, and demanded the gov to adhere to Constitutional limitations on power, all those things would have never been necessary. It's past generations that have fucked us over.

Unless and until you understand what the REAL problem is, it will continue to exist. The masses will demand socialism.

To understand what the real problem is, requires the studying of history. How many you see wanting to do that?

I'm proposing to take the laborer off the street and have them learn transferable skills.

Who is gonna pay to do that? Why not just let them learn their own skills by starting at the bottom and working their way up?

Of course that won't work if people think they should be able to stay in the same low pay entry level job all their lives and still be able to keep up with the Joneses. There has never been a time that that works.

I'm proposing to allow employers to take advantage of the foreign laborers,

How 'bout we just get rid of the foreign labor and have companies compete for American workers?

I'm proposing to allow employers to take advantage of the foreign laborers, but pay so much in taxes that we can afford to keep up the non-working Americans. If you have 100 people to pick from but, 80 of them will cost you in higher taxes versus better pay for the American worker, it's pretty simple which way you will go.

Those taxes will just get passed along in the form of higher prices and/or lower quality goods and services for their customers. Which fuels inflation. Which means that's not a good idea.

 

[CuriousFiend]

Not at all. People gaining experience and finding a better job is how it is supposed to work.

Sure, although we ought to highlight that it would be erroneous to equate the gaining of actual experience as strictly arising from modern institutionalized "education"....which—overall—generally is now premised upon cartoonishly subversive ideologies and more or less amounts to covert indoctrination.

 

[Joe King]

Sure, although we ought to highlight that it would be erroneous to equate the gaining of actual experience as strictly arising from modern institutionalized "education"

I thought that was a given.

....which—overall—generally is now premised upon cartoonishly subversive ideologies and more or less amounts to covert indoctrination.

Couldn't agree more. Most "higher learning" "schools" have been turned into indoctrination centers that do little more than saddle their "students" with huge debt.

 

[MalO]

Anyone working a minimum wage job for more than a year or two out of high school, has no one to blame but themselves. Minimum wage is for entry level workers with no skills.

167 million people in the USA labor force

1 in 3 earn less than $15 an hour.

55.6 million people aren't earning shit because they want to. It's not their fault, it's the fault of this damn system.

The USA is not providing enough good jobs to its citizens. Point blank.

Our people deserve better than this.

 

[MalO]

Every job that pays a wage should pay a living wage.

There is no "entry level jobs for teenagers"

If the employer thinks a job isn't worth paying a living wage, the employer should get off his lazy fat ass and do that job himself. The rich fatass can keep doing it himself until he is willing to pay a living wage to someone else so they can do it.

Personally I think the point should be driven home with torches and pitchforks.

 

[weaponoffreedom]

167 million people in the USA labor force

1 in 3 earn less than $15 an hour.

55.6 million people aren't earning shit because they want to. It's not their fault, it's the fault of this damn system.

The USA is not providing enough good jobs to its citizens. Point blank.

Our people deserve better than this.

let me ask you a question:

@18 years old
if you were earning minimum wage and had no money in the bank, just enough not to starve...........and then all upon a sudden someone deposited 1500 in your account, would you go to work the next day?

if your answer is yes, then you are a liar

if someone all of a sudden deposited 250000 in your account, would you call in sick for a week?

if your answer is no, you are a liar

minimum wage is a protection for the people, namely the young 16yo working their first job, learning the world, never meant for a career, or a guaranteed income. If you think otherwise, you are misinformed

 

[weaponoffreedom]

Every job that pays a wage should pay a living wage.

so that hot pocket you are munching on right now as we speak, would be 15 bucks a pop rather than 3................you good with that?

There is no "entry level jobs for teenagers

there is this thing called McD's, i know you just about live there, they make McNuggets

Personally I think the point should be driven home with torches and pitchforks.

that is the precise reason I own a Kalashnikov rifle......you know the communist gun.


it seems like you are a communist or socialist...............so another question:

in this "living wages" world what would your job be?

 

[MalO]

so that hot pocket you are munching on right now as we speak, would be 15 bucks a pop rather than 3................you good with that?

In the 1950's the USA emerged from WW2 as the only developed nation with its industry intact. For the next 20 years almost everything was made in the USA and it had a single income economy where only dad needed to work and was able to afford a middle class standard of living for his entire family. Home, car, wife, kids, food on the table, and extra money for eating out or going to a movie.

In 2024 the miniimum wage has been stagnant for 15 years and yet the cost of living is skyrocketing year after year. More Americans are on public assistance than ever before and houses, cars, and food all cost much more than they did in the 50's even when adjusted for inflation.

In 1950 the average new car cost $1,510. Can you buy a new family sedan for $15,100? median new car price in the U.S. is $38,723.

A new home in 1950 cost and average of $8,000. Can you buy a new home in the U.S. for $80,000? Median home price in the U.S. is $404,700.

Cost of food has decreased adjusted for inflation, because in 1950 food was locally farmed by small time farmers where as today most food is produced on corporate-owned megafarms. However a hot pocket still wouldn't cost $15. They might cost 4 or 5 dollars each going by this website:

How Much Grocery Store Items Cost In 1950 Vs. 2020

For generations, people have commented on the rising cost of groceries, but when factoring in inflation, some items are actually cheaper today than they were in the 1950s. Food prices in 1950 were measured in cents, but in 2020 those prices go up exponentially. That milkshake you'd be sharing...

www.ranker.com

If I could choose between the economy of 1950 and the economy of today, what would I choose?

The single income economy of the 1950's with fair wages, affordable housing, affordable cars, and expensive food?

Or the double income economy of the 2020's with low wages, expensive housing, expensive cars, and cheap food?

I'd pick the economy of the 1950's. Quality of life is more important than cheap hot pockets.

 

[MalO]

it seems like you are a communist or socialist...............so another question:

in this "living wages" world what would your job be?

No I'm a capitalist. However I'm not a crony capitalist, which it seems a lot of people on this forum are.

Crony Capitalism is indistinguishable from Communism and totalitarianism. On paper they are different, but look at the end result:

"Free Market" Capitalism: People are free to earn money for their product or labor, and have equal representation in a society that doesn't distinguish between an upper class aristocracy or lower class peasantry. The economy is decentralized because most products and services are produced by individual business owners rather than a corporate or government run entity.

Crony Capitalism: Rich business owners dominate the market by a combination of cut-throat business practices that drive small business owners out of business, corporate lobbying which is just another word for political bribery to get unfair business laws passed in their favor, and the ability to hire more lawyers than the small people so they can win court cases and get all sorts of exemptions when they file their taxes and pay less tax than anyone else, especially those poor people.

Because big businesses have so much influence over government, and posses so much wealth compared to everyone else in the economy, they make most of the planning decisions. This means Crony Capitalist economies are centrally planned for the most part. This effectively creates a class-based society where the rich have more representation, wealth, and privileges than everyone else in society.

Fun fact: Donald Trump paid $750 in income tax for 2017. I paid more than that in income tax in 2017. Donald Trump is a billionaire who owns more than 500 businesses. I am not and don't own even one. This is why I advocate a flat income tax. Everyone who earns any amount of income should pay 15% with no exemptions and no possibility for deductions, no matter who you are, who you know, or how many lawyers you employ.

Communism: The government dictates the prices of goods and services, and what people earn for wages. This means the economy is centralized (Communism is commonly referred to as a centrally planned economy). On paper this is supposed to benefit the people. In reality the party leaders who run the government become the new aristocracy and are the wealthiest members of society. Since these party leaders wield all legislative, judicial, and miltiary power no one is able to stop them. This is why Communism always ends up looking like a dicatatorship.

Totalitarianism: One guy wields all the military power and kills anyone who disagrees. He gets all the money and makes all the laws and decisions. By its very nature the economy is centrally planned and it certainly is class based. Either you are the dictator or someone he has chosen to wield power, or you are not.

 

[Joe King]

minimum wage is a protection for the people, namely the young 16yo working their first job, learning the world, never meant for a career, or a guaranteed income.

Yet today we got people expecting to flip burgers at a fast food joint as a lifetime career. lol

there is this thing called McD's, i know you just about live there, they make McNuggets

They already pay close to double minimum wage just to start.

Who are all these people he thinks are toiling away for $7.25/hr?

In the 1950's the USA emerged from WW2 as the only developed nation with its industry intact. For the next 20 years almost everything was made in the USA and it had a single income economy where only dad needed to work and was able to afford a middle class standard of living for his entire family. Home, car, wife, kids, food on the table, and extra money for eating out or going to a movie.

Only reason we don't have that anymore is due to the gov's and fed's fiscal and monetary mismanagement.

Quality of life is more important than cheap hot pockets.

Until those expensive hot pockets cost enough to put a crimp on that quality.

 

[Joe King]

and have equal representation in a societ that doesn't distinguish between an upper class aristocracy or lower class peasantry.

To do that, make all taxes equal for everyone. Dollar amount, not as a percent.

Gov is a service that we should all pay equally for. That we have a system that charges some people more, is why some people end up with better representation and access to government.

The bonus is that we end up with the small, limited power gov the Founders promised us.

 

[MalO]

Yet today we got people expecting to flip burgers at a fast food joint as a lifetime career. lol

Because that is a lifetime career for tens of millions of Americans.

Also it's not funny.

There are not nearly enough good jobs for everyone in our country. If you had the choice between homelessness or flipping burgers, what would you choose?

No you don't get to pick something different, because tens of millions of people don't have a third option.

 

[MalO]

To do that, make all taxes equal for everyone. Dollar amount, not as a percent.

Gov is a service that we should all pay equally for. That we have a system that charges some people more, is why some people end up with better representation and access to government.

The bonus is that we end up with the small, limited power gov the Founders promised us.

That's crony capitalist talk. It's abhorrent and not how a free society is supposed to be run.

The privileged man defending his gross and wonton privileges.

It's like King Henry VIII devouring a feast in front of a starving man and explaining why the starving man deserves to suffer in misery at the bottom of an oubliette. "This is only just and moral"

 

[Joe King]

Because that is a lifetime career for tens of millions of Americans.

Also it's not funny.

There are not nearly enough good jobs for everyone in our country. If you had the choice between homelessness or flipping burgers, what would you choose?

No you don't get to pick something different, because tens of millions of people don't have a third option.

You seem to not understand how jobs work.


If flipping burgers is seen as a lifetime career, it's only because those people aren't trying hard enough.

Too many just want shit handed to them, as opposed to putting forth effort and determinization to make something better for themselves.